1. Note that Nel is teasing toward Chicken, while Sula is kind. Can you make a guess as to what motivates each to behave the way she does?
2. Chicken goes under water and is gone--suddenly drowned. Can you connect this incident with any other part of the book?
3. Can anyone make sense of the meeting between Sula and Shadrack?
4. Can you explain what is racist about the bargeman's reaction to finding Chicken's body? "Ham's sons" refers to dark-skinned people with African ancestry, named after one of Noah's sons (from the Bible).
2. Chicken goes under water and is gone--suddenly drowned. Can you connect this incident with any other part of the book?
3. Can anyone make sense of the meeting between Sula and Shadrack?
4. Can you explain what is racist about the bargeman's reaction to finding Chicken's body? "Ham's sons" refers to dark-skinned people with African ancestry, named after one of Noah's sons (from the Bible).
15 comments:
Adressing to question number 3, the meeting between Sula and shadrack was very strange to me. I was expecting that he would do something to her by coming into his cottage. O_o
I don't even know If I can make sense of the meeting of Sula and Shadrack. Maybe he didn't do anythnig to her because she's just a kid. I don't know...
"He was smiling, a great big smile, heavy with lust and time to come. He nooded his head as though answering a question, and said, in a pleasent conversational tone of cooled butter, "Always." Pg.62
Hmmmm....What do he mean by "always" Shadrack is weird. >_<
Even though Nel and Sula are close friends, they act very differently towards Chicken when they are playing. Nel is tormenting chicken and acting very rude, while Sula is being kind and gentle.
Nel said, "Your mamma tole you to stop eatin' snot, Chicken." From the beginning of their encounter Nel was acting rude. While Sula was trying to take him by the hand and comfort him. I think that Nel was being mean because she is uncomfortable with herself and she is jealous that Chicken is getting the attention from Sula. I think that Sula just brushes it off and doesn't notice that Nel thinks she is ignoring her.
Yoo
When chicken is underwater and drowns, I think this connects to a lot of parts of the book, but one in particular stands out to me. At the beginning of the book, it describes that their neighborhood is known as the bottom. It's viewed as the bottom because when they look up, God is looking down at them, therefore allowing them to be named the bottom. I find it very similar to this situation. I find it similar because the community as a whole is already viewed as "less important" than that of the white and they can do whatever they want, etc. The fact that chicken dies and the book neglects to include a funeral, this suggests that the initial metaphor of God was true. Death and certain occurances that occur in the bottom are clearly less important than the lives of the white people.
Hey Everyone!
So I am addressing question 1. Nel and Sula do act very differently towards Chicken and I'm not exactly sure however I do have a couple of guesses. Going along with what Kelsey was saying I do think that Nel was being mean as some sort of resentment. A lot of (not to be stereo-typical,, since I am one but) girls change their personaltities depending on who they are around. Also that fact that Sula was giving chicken so much attention, could play another fact. The other possibility was that Sula was up to something. She was incredibly nice to Chicken and the nicer she became the more mean Nel was. In my opinion this could have been a game to Sula. There are a lot ofother possibilities, but in all honesty I haven't completely dissectesd this section of the reading yet. I look forward to seeing what the rest of you have to say and I hope at least one of you will be able to help me find more supporting details for my claim!
I think it is a little ironic that Sula is so nice to Chicken, helping him climb a tree and see a view he has never seen before. And then, by some freak accident he slips from her fingers into the water. What seems odd to me about this is the fact that neither Sula or Nel tried to save him directly, maybe they can't swim?
The fact that it is Sula that last had contact with Chicken makes it strange. As his happiest moments are what Sula shares with him right before he dies, before their hands break free from one another.
In comparison to Nel, I agree with Kelsey and Ashlie. If it were me, I'm honestly not sure how nice I would be, but Nel was being rude. More than being rude she didn't seem to want anything to do with Chicken. Nel seems content with it just being her and Sula for the moment.
Hey Everyone,
Continuing with what Shenese has already mentioned on the issue of question number 3, I agree with what she has said. I did find this almost awkward moment a little strange and hard to make sense of. The quote "He was smiling, a great big smile, heavy with lust and time to come. He nodded his head as though answering a question, and said, in a pleasant conversational tone of cooled butter, "Always." helps to unveil what Shadrack might have been feeling. The fact that he is smiling is kind of ironic. This is because some poor innocent boy has just drowned and there he is smiling. It doesn't say the date of when Chicken dies, but I am almost sure it isn't even on National Suicide Day. I also found it ironic how both Sula and Shadrack do not even acknowledge the fact that he is dying and that they aren't going to try and save him. If it were me I know for a fact that I would be running around madly looking for someone to help save him. It is also a little strange that Shadrack answers the non verbal question in the manner he did. "He nodded his head as though answering a question, and said, in a pleasent conversational tone of cooled butter, "Always." It's rather strange that he said always in a pleasant conversational tone of cooled butter. It's almost like he was expecting her to come over (and that's why he didn't get upset with her) and that he has seen innocent people die many times before. Maybe this wasn't his first time witnessing a death and has witnessed several before and has never missed one, hence saying "Always." These are just my ideas and I look forward to reading some others.
I think Nel is mean to Chicken because she was raised a good girl and always had rules to follow. Sula was raised among disorder and free of rules. Sula, however isn't mean to Chicken. Sula sees no point to it. Nel might be acting out on behalf of rebelling against what she was taught to be proper and right. Nel isn't used to acting the way she wants, even if there's no point to being rude to Chicken. Sula wanted to be nice so she helped Chicken into the tree.
by the way, I find this whole scene very disturbing and uncomfortable!!! Why didn't they save him from drowning or did Chicken hit a rock in the water and die suddenly?
Good evening!
I feel that there are many reasons the bargeman's reaction could be considered racist. Firstly, when he first saw a dead black figure in the water, he wasn't even planning on picking it up until he realized it was a child and then felt morally obligated to get it. The book says that he would not have gotten it had it been an old black man, which is the first racist commentary. Secondly, he was "disgusted" that some parent would intentionally drown their child. He just assumes that that is what happened to him simply because he is of a black family. He does not give any consideration to the fact that the child may have accidentally drowned. He is simply stereotyping the family of Chicken to be brutal and inhuman, because of their color. Thirdly, the words "dumped" and "hauled" were used to describe how the bargeman handled the body, instead of with care and concern. Also, he finds himself to be "burdened" with this problem and the fact that he has to deal with the African American community at all. Taking care of Chicken's body was a pain and hassle he wasn't too excited to be involved in. He won't even take time to take the body back to Medallion once he found out where it was from, and instead leaves the situation to become somebody else's problem. Another disturbing thing is that he leaves the body hanging in the water to become gross and disfigured because he is more concerned with his wool.
All of this evidence points to the bargeman's racist opinions of Chicken and his death, and demonstrates the relationship between various races in the 20's. I was saddened by his actions, and disappointed that finding a dead person in the water could have such little emotional effect on someone just because they have no respect for that person's race.
See you all tomorrow!!
Pertaining to question #3, I agree with Mason that the incident of Chicken's drowning is similiar to the neighborhood. What the incident also reminds me of is Shadrack's posttraumatic event when he was in the battlefield witnessing the death of his comrades. Shadrack lost his sanity after he was put into the hospital; he is spiritually dead. Compared to Shadrack, Chicken drowns and does not return alive.
I think there is a connection in the story between Chicken Little drowning and Plum being lit on fire and burning to death. These are both very painful, unexpected, and uncommon ways of dying. When Eva lit her son on fire, she was holding him just seconds before and he felt so content and at peace with her. Just before Chicken was thrown into the water, he was as happy as could be and bubbling with laughter and Sula was enjoying swinging him around in the air. The sudden shock of their unfortunate fates were very real and threw me off as the reader.
(3) The encounter between Sula and Shadrack is very difficult for me to make sense of. I will try. Sula shows up at Shadrack's house to ask him if he saw what happened. She find that he is not there and is standing there taking in his home, which is surprisingly orderly and clean. She doesn't notice his presence in the doorway, and when she suddenly does, she is no longer frightened. This is because she is no longer intimidated because of the gentleness of his hand on the door way. The gentleness and tenderness of his hands suggests that maybe Sula was looking at him with admiration. The tenderness of his grasp on the doorway possibly triggered thoughts in Sula of encouragement and trust in Shadrack. Thus causing him to maybe think that she was looking at him in a way of affection. His eyes follow her out of the door way, gazing at her and turning with her. His obviously interested in the way she looks, and what she is doing there. The book says that as she is leaving her courage starts to quickly leave her. This suggests to me that her sudden burst of encouragement and leaves her as she realizes he is watching her. Shadrack's smile that is full of lust and time to come suggests that he has thought of Sula in a way that is very mature and inappropriate, especially for her age. Then when he nods and says always, Sula is extremely scared and runs away. This is hard to make sense of, but maybe Shadrack was saying I'm "always" here to come to. Shadrack may think that Sula came in search of a lover or a man in her life, thus the smile full of lust. Maybe for a split second Sula feels this and doesn't immediately reject it (the encouragement of the tenderness of the hand on the doorway) and then is completely appalled at this feeling and frightened at the consideration of a man being interested in her.
I don't know if that made sense, but it is a confusing section.
Chicken goes under water and is gone--suddenly drowned. Can you connect this incident with any other part of the book?
Chickens sudden accident reminds me of when Nel and her mother travel to Nel's great grandmother's house. It isn't as nearly as tragic as Chicken's death and it is not the fact that both die that forms a connection to me. The correlation, to me, is in the theme of loss. When Chicken is gone, the reaction from the others is that of unfamiliarity and a harsh reality hits. Just like when Nel discovers how poorly colored people are treated in the surrounding areas, like the bus. Nel feels that unfamiliar feeling of loss, just as I feel one feels when someone dies tragically... that, "what, I had no idea, how does this work, what do I do now?" feeling.
I feel like the confrontation between Shadrack and Sula was extremely interesting. I feel that Shadrack has been watching Sula "always" and has been aware of her for a long time. Because of this i see the possibility of there being a past relationship between Eva and Shadrack or Helen and Shadrack in some way.
Hello,
Addressing question one, I think Nel and Sula both treat Chicken this way as sort of a game. I think Sula is "nice" to Chicken and helps him climb the tree not because she feels compassion but because she is smarter and knows she will succeed in drawing him in. However I think they are both just playing a game and they show no remorse when Chicken drowns.
Chicken is underwater and he is gone. This incident is somewhat
prophesized by many other coincedance that happened before his death. Maybe his death is not even ironic because he was different. He is seperate from the whole society in that time of period. It was obvious that nobody would really give an attention that would build a stepping tool to really find out his accidental case. His death is already reflected with his identity or destiny which is sadly the society or the nature itself already setted up for him, an unreasonable death.
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