Jane Fonda as Nora and David Warner as Helmer in a made for TV production of A Doll's House.
1. To what extent does Nora gain our admiration by the end of the play?
OR
2. The slam of the door at the end of the play is famous. Speculate as to why it might be.
OR
3. Krogstad: do we know enough about him for his restoration to the ranks of virtuous characters to make sense? Is it the actor's job to make the transformation credible?
OR
4. Assume for a moment that the play is a critique of urban Norwegian society of Ibsen's time. What does Ibsen disapprove of in his society, based on this play?
OR
2. The slam of the door at the end of the play is famous. Speculate as to why it might be.
OR
3. Krogstad: do we know enough about him for his restoration to the ranks of virtuous characters to make sense? Is it the actor's job to make the transformation credible?
OR
4. Assume for a moment that the play is a critique of urban Norwegian society of Ibsen's time. What does Ibsen disapprove of in his society, based on this play?
30 comments:
"[sinks down on a chair by the door, face buried in his hands.] Nora! Nora! [looking about and rising.] Empty. She's gone. [A sudden hope leaps in him.] The greatest miracle -- ?
[from below, the sound of a door slamming shut.]"
I think the reason the slamming of the door is so important is that it follows Torvald's statement: "the greatest miracle -- ?" in a way which implies that Nora's leaving is, in fact, the greatest miracle. Their relationship dynamic was really harmful, and stifled both of them. Neither was able to truly rely on the other, and neither was able to deal with marital situations that sprung up. This final action emphasizes what Nora said previously, that she has to inflict upon Torvald the unimaginable in order for their relationship to stand a chance. Nora has consistently played the submissive role, so it is all the more powerful that she performs this final and decisive action.
While it is hard to believe that Nora's final decision is anything more than another flight of fancy, and while I think it selfish of her to abandon her children regardless of her own crisis, I respect her by the end of the play. She comes a long way in the sense that she begins to recognize the importance of her individuality. This desire for knowledge and freedom is admirable, regardless of its costs.
I think that the door slamming shut also signifies Nora's complete freedom. Previously just a pretty bird in a cage or a doll in a house , Nora is finally allowed to do what she really wants and not think about what Torvald will think or what the children will think. her life with Torvald revolved around what would please him and he liked being able to manipulate his little songbird. he even goes as far to say it is her "feminine helplessness" that makes her so attractive to him. A door slamming shut is generally an act of defiance in terms of a teenager slamming his/her bedroom door or whatever, but here in such a fast turnaround where Nora seemingly redeems herself in the eyes of the readers/viewers the slamming door is a surprise to the viewer. After all the old Nora would never have such a thing.
Just from reading the text, Krostad's transformation seems a bit perplexing. It's possible that his love for Mrs. Linde is deep enough that just having her back in his life is enough to transform him, but to go from being bent on ruining the lives of the Torvalds to not having any issue with them is a quick transition. It is the actor's job to portray this, and to have always presented the possibility of virtue within him from the beginning, so that it could fully emerge when met with Mrs. Linde's proposal.
Also, with regards to the door slam--a door slamming makes a final, absolute statement. In a time when theater was high-brow and genteel, many aspects of the show must have been shocking: Helmer's trying to get Nora to go to bed with him, and more importantly her break through at the end. The idea that a woman would gladly leave her husband and family to discover herself and figure the world out must have been a controversial one. Ending the play with the slamming of the door offers no other possibility to audience members who might want an alternate ending, who wouldn't want to see a wife leave her husband. There is no way to see it delicately.
2. The slamming of the door at the end of the play, is famous because not only does it give a visual or oratory description of Nora's leaving, but it also emphasizes that there is no hope left in Nora and Helmer's relationship.
"Nora! Nora! (Looking down and rising.) Empty she's gone. (A sudden hope leaps in him.) The greatest miracle~?
(From below, the sound of a door slamming shut.)"
If the play had ended with these two lines in reverse it would have given a completely different feeling. Instead of Nora having the last say or action, Helmer would override Nora's door slamming with his hope, and therefore instead of the play ending with Nora's strong newfound independence, it would end with a strong feeling of hope for Nora and Helmer's relationship. It would be as if Helmer was foreshadowing what was to come, that he and Nora would get back together with Nora's Independence ending. But instead, Nora's door slam is the last line of the play reassuring the reader that she is not coming back and shuts down Helmer's hope of fixing their relationship, as if his hope was just a silly childish dream that would never come true.
I'm sorry to continue with the same topic, but I actually interpreted Torvald's last line a bit differently than Gabi when I first read it. "The greatest miracle-?" to me was Torvald waiting for Nora to turn around and come back, as though the miracle to him would be to have her return to being his little songbird. After seeing him throughout the entire play as a demeaning and degrading character I have a hard time thinking that he could be glad that his wife just left him. I think that Torvald was very worried about what everyone in town and at the bank would think of him when they found out that Nora just walked out on him. I think that the dash and question mark indicate Torvald waiting to hear Nora coming back up the stairs. This is why the slamming door is so powerful, like others have said it is a very final ending action. Nora finally stood up to Torvald, and the way I read it, he still could not accept that fact. So the slamming of the door is just another way that Nora finally stands up to the feminism and has the final word, as Annabel said.
I think Nora really does gain our admiration by the end of the play, in that she goes out on her own. This play is strange in the sense that one cannot exactly predict how it's going to end. As relationships so often happen in life, you can't exactly predict how they are going to end. Especially marriages, because as we have discussed before, people often marry to meet needs, such as Jude marrying Nel in Sula. It's hard to define exactly what the perfect marriage is, because love exists in such strange forms in human relationships.
Forgive me theater majors, but it's as if Nora has been playing one "role" her entire life, and now she realizes it, and wants to just get out, because she isn't sure she can change her role as she wants to.
I don't know if anyone else felt the same way, but I was so proud of Nora in the end! We gain her admiration because, after all these years of playing the perfect, cute, housewife she finally comes out and says what she wants. Year after year she has only listened to people, never doing or thinking what she wants and has let herself become, as she says, a doll in a dollhouse. I remember one blog before I wondered whether the reason Nora indulges in little things is because it helps her forget something that we don't know about yet. That was in fact true. She enjoyed lying and secretly eating macaroons because it was something she could do on her own.
We especially gain admiration not just because Nora finally breaks through, but because she finally breaks the barrier between her and Torvald. She can finally stand up to him and realize that she has a much, much greater purpose in life than what society calls for.
"I believe that, before all else, I'm a human being, no less than you- or anyway, I ought to try to become one. I know the majority thinks you're right, Torvald, and plenty of books agree with you, too. But I can't go on believing what the majority says, or what's written in books. I have to think over these things myself and try to understand them."
This, to me, was an extremely important passage from the play and reflects the whole feminism theme.
The slamming door is a great symbol of power for Nora. It symbolizes that their relationship is over, but it also symbolizes that she is now not afraid to show that she is not okay with being subservient. While it is an end, it is also a beginning.She is strong for doing this, and is showing her children love by doing this.
I think Nora leaving at the end is a very triumphant ending. This gained our admiration greatly because it is human nature to want to escape from the things that hurt us. It takes a lot of strength to get away from those situations most of the time and particularly in a relationship/family situation. It was incredible strong of her to leave the ones she loved to find herself and to lead the life that she wanted all along because we all only have so long to live why not live it the way we want to? I think her leaving is something that is a situation that everyone can relate to in some way or other. The amount of power she shows and self respect that she has in the end makes her that much more admirable.
checking in
checking in.
i really like what sierra said:
This gained our admiration greatly because it is human nature to want to escape from the things that hurt us.
Yeah!
checking in
christine and sierra i agree!
Checking in...I like Chrsitine's comment about Nora breaking the barrier between her and Torvald because it puts a great image in my mind of all that has stood between the two characters.
checking in
I think Nora gains the reader's respect because she ignites the feeling of independence. Sure she left her family behind, but people give her sympathy because she left a horrible situation. Her society and her husband have created this trap that encourages nora to act the way she does. The mystery of not fully understanding Nora makes the reader inquisitive about her, and in turn makes it so that you root for her. She is a true protagonist, and she gets what she wants in the end. Her achievement of independence and being her own person triumphs the social limits of her decision to leave.
I think why the slam of the door is so famous, or at least important, is its symbolism. The slamming of a door signifies finality, which I don't think we thought would come from Nora, especially because of her child-like naivity and her co-dependence on her husband.
3 passages that struck me the most were on page 1042.
"I have to stand completely alone, if I'm ever going to discover myself and the world out there. So I can't go on living with you."
..
"From here on, there's no use forbidding me anything. I'll take with me wahtever is mine. I don't want a thing from you, either now or later."
and one more ..
"Tomorrow I'm going home - I mean, home where I came from. It'll be easier up there to find something to do."
Why these passages of dialogue in which Nora speaks to Torvald struck me was because Nora's attitude seems to do a complete 360: she goes from a co-dependent, child-like plaything to an independent woman (I didn't mean for that to be a Destiny's Child referrence ..). I also find it interesting how she says she doesn't want anything from Torvald now or ever again, and that's going to home - the home where she grew up, instead of this playworld that Torvald created for her.
I also think there's something to be said about Nora's revelation that we can't find ourselves in other people, but it's a reflection for our flaws and our attributes and it's our job to take what we learn from others and use it to build on ourselves.
Although I find Nora's actions a bit selfish, I admire her conviction in self-reflection and fufilment, and knowing what she wants and doesn't want. I don't think most of us have the courage to leave what seems familiar to us behind, especially if we have roots and family to feed, but I think that's what makes the door slaming so powerful: the defiance against settling and adhearing to what seems ordinary (the husband, the kids, the wonderful house, the dinner parties) to find something much more worth while, which is the coming to terms with finding herself.
That was really long. I apologize.
The slamming of the door at the end of the play is significant as it symbolises the end of Torvald's upper hand over her, the beginning of her freedom from Torvald and their relationship that did not bring out the best of each other - instead it restrained them from being themselves.
checking in.
checking in
I already blogged but im blogging again as my check in...
Though i agree that Nora redeems herself in some ways, i think that it is sort of awful at the same time. I mean yeah she had no idea who she really was or what she really wanted but she did start a life on her own and i believe Torvald says something about her being a mother and a wife above all. While the duty to herself takes precedent, it is as though she feels willing to drop those two duties completely despite the fact that their lives are intertwined. I did feel bad for Nora but in some ways i feel like she was essentially past the point of no return. As adolescents we have time to figure ourselves out before we settle down into a routine life. We don't have wives or husbands or kids (usually) so its okay that we are constantly slamming doors and changing, but for a mother to do that to her kids almost counteracts redeeming herself.
Checking In. I agree with kate because as good for Nora it is to be free and independent the questionable part is her children. It almost makes her freedom too selfish because they cannot take care of themselves with out her but if she had just left her husband that would be ok because it was unhealthy but her children need her so it does counteract the admiration we feel for her.
I agree with Julie in that you can not predict how relationships are going to end. I do believe however that you can predict whether a relationship is going to end or not. How the two people in a relationship function together can tell whether or not they have the potential to stay together. It was easy for me to see from the very start that Nora and Torval would have a broken apart relationship in the end. I must say that I also strongly agree with Julie about being forced to play the same role her entire life and that is the reason she wants to get out in the end. She needs to break free and fly freely, instead of being set as to one thing set by Torvald her entire life. She's sick of the repitition.
I would agree that the slamming of the door makes us have a lot of respect for Nora and makes us somewhat proud of her; the "little songbird" or "child" has finally found her own voice and opinion. She's finally going out to live her life on her own and experience a life that doesn't revolve around playing this role of submissive little girl in a relationship that is essentially a charade in itself... meaning it is most definitely a charade- all an act.
However, it is really disturbing to me that Nora has just deserted her family. A few people have touched upon this, but I really cannot believe at all that she would leave her children who were all described as being so cute and adorable and loving toward their mother. I want to respect Nora and be happy for her that she's gone to start a new life and experience everything for the first time on her own, but I really can't because (and this is a big part of her maturity... or lack thereof) she didn't even recognize the huge responsibility she had of taking care of her children and being there for them. I understand walking out on her husband, but I think she should have taken her children and her nanny with her and then found some way to support them. I feel absolutely terrible for her poor children who will now have no mother.
Checking in.
I also agree with what Catherine says about Torvald's intention with his last line. There is a dash in there at the end of the sentence, so he obviously is not finishing some kind of thought or just pauses mid-thought because of Nora not coming back.
checking in
I don't know whether to admire or be absolutely and utterly surprised.
When it comes to Nora, of course there's a sense of admiration now. She's decided she no longer is in love with her husband, she no longer wants to see her children. She says she will think about them, but will not speak to them. It all happens so fast.
There's one part when Torvald tells her that he finds her all the more attractive for her dependency on him. That's the admirable part, I think. When she says no. That's when she makes her decision and takes a stance.
I cannot deny that there's a sense of foolishness in what she's done, however. But then again, this entire play has a very foolish plot. All who are around have very foolish qualities.
So, yes, we do somewhat admire Nora for taking a stance and realizing that she has to make something of herself. That she has her very own mission. But that's as far as my admiration goes, the rest is all terribly confusing.
Leaving her children is a very deceiving characteristic.
checking in
Last blog of the semester, that's a weird thought. Anyway, it doesn't look like many people looked at question 4 (Ibsen's view on society) so I'll take a crack at it.
It almost goes without saying that A Doll's House was highly controversial subject matter when it debuted in 1879. Unlike other playwrights of his time, Ibsen focused on relevent subject matter to the days issues.
Many playwrights wrote about the impossible, the unimaginable, things that could never occur in real life. And while that is partially why we have theater - for why would we go see a show about everyday life when we could just sit in the comfort of our own home and do that? - theater is also meant to be controversial. It brings up the questions that no one else is comfortable talking about at least openly. This is why Ibsen's writing itself was so controversial.
Theater is about raising questions and being thought provoking. One primary example is Ibsen's positive view on feminism, although at the time he denied that that was the focus of the play. For the period and convention of the play A Doll's House seems to be spot on with the times. The Helmers are just a bourgeoisie (middle/upper class) family. Torvald is the breadwinner by day and stageparent by night. He brings Nora home the bacon and like most, if not all, wives at this time she cooks it.
Clearly, Ibsen disapproves on the inequality that women (specifically house wives) faced in comparison to their husbands. Nora leaving Torvald at the end of the play shows Ibsen's strong feelings to the subject - a wife actually leaving her husband in those days was completely unspeakable and unheard of! How could a woman make such an important decision? At least, that is what they thought at the time.
While he may have been ahead of his time, he believed that all people, both men and women were created equal and should share equal opportunities. And his play, while perhaps one of the first famous plays about feminism and equality of women, was certainly not the last.
- Checking in -
Obviously, Ibsen disapprove a unequal right and man's superiority toward women, especially married women in his play. I felt that the ending was very exaggerated. This exaggeration, or dramatic change at the end of the story makes a clear contrast between the beginning of the story and the ending of the story, so it can show how woman's right was terrible in Ibsen's time. However, I think this is too exaggerated. Until the chapter 2, Nora is someone who is sort of dumb, but all the sudden after having some argument, she suddenly turn into a new being, which doesn't make sense at all.
Also, the slam of the door at the end of the play is famous due to all these reasons other people mentioned before me, but it also has a meaning that now Helmer is someone who is locked inside the house, therefore in some sense Helmer is the doll in a doll's house.
Post a Comment