Having read this section, what question do you have at this point? You MUST come up with a question. If you have the same question as someone else, try to refine or develop the question a bit. If in addition to asking a question, you would like to try to respond to someone's question, great!
32 comments:
Do you think that Nora feels superior to Kristine?
For people in theater, I'm sorry, but this section really reminded me of the play 'Dinner with Friends' by Donald Margulies. Nora and Kristine seem like Karen and Beth (respectively) not necessarily in their situation but in their type of relationship.
Nora and Karen seem to have the perfect life (at least relatively to Kristine and Beth); they are well off, they are in a steady marriage, and they SEEM happy. Kristine and Beth on the other hand, don't have life very well off (BUT this assumption is through the eyes of Nora and Karen).
This leads me to my second question: Who do you think is happier Nora or Kristine?
It would seem that Nora is happier because she's had an 'easier' life but she puts on this air that she has to convince people that she thinks life couldn't be any better so is she really happy?
This might be a stupid question, but I really have no idea. Why does Nora call her husband Torvald when in the play it reads Helmer? Did I just miss something?
Also I want to know what the "big thing" Nora is talking about, and I wonder if the reason she takes up such pleasure in sweets and money is because something terrible happened, and that just keeps her mind off it.
P.S. that was kind of like mike's question...woops.
P.P.S i like your picture mike
Why does Nora feel the need to have been through more?
It seems as though everyone, her husband and Kristine, all think she's innocent and hasn't been through anything. To tie into Christine's question, I also wonder about the big thing. I wonder if maybe, potentially, it didn't actually happen, but is more her making something up in order to seem like she has been through more than she has? Just maybe...?
Love the Dinner With Friends reference Mike :). Works very well...
Hey Christine, Nora's husbands name is Torvald Helmer. Helmer is his last name (the surname of the family).
- Checking in (a little early) but i'll try to double check back later! -
Haha, Christine. :)
My question is: How do you think Nora sees her relationship with Mrs. Linde?
p.s. Totally irrelevent, but Mike, why do you have an empty blog?
Oh...haha thank you Mike! I thought I probably missed something.
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Also, going off of Mike and Julie, it just seems so weird to me that Nora and Torvald are so, extremely, ridiculously happy it almost seems fake. I wonder if it's a cover up.
So I'm not sure if I can turn this into a question, but I was confused by the fact that Nora felt the need to vocalize the fact that she was acting selfish and talking all about herself. This may go along with the "faking it" idea, like their lives are all just a social cover?? So I guess my question is why does Nora need to tell her old friend, if Kristine was her "friend", that she's sorry for talking so much but then continue talking. Does she really not have any self control? Or does Nora not actually care about talking about herself and just feels the need to pretend to care by mentioning it?
Does Kristine feel superior to Nora?
This question is the opposite of Mike's, and it occured to me based on the character of Miss Kilman in Mrs Dalloway, who felt superior to Clarissa because she was morally upright, practical, intelligent, and rational. She criticized Clarissa's need for societal approval, and her concern for material wealth. The relationship dynamic seems similar in the case of Nora and Kristine. Nora, like Clarissa, is made out to be foolish by both her husband and her friend. She feels the need to prove to Kristine that she is a serious and capable person.
To answer your question Mike, I think if Nora felt superior to Kristine she would not feel the need to prove that she had gone through hard times. So no, I don't think she feels superior. I think it is the other way around. Kristine scorns Nora's silliness and easiness with money. Like Miss Kilman, she sees this concern with her image as weakness.
At the same time, however, Kristine initially sought wealth by marrying a well-to-do man. She's not as black and white as Miss Kilman, and she's quick to ask for assistance from Nora. I feel like Nora is being used, and I DON'T think she's as foolish as her conversation with her husband makes her out to be.
What do you guys think?
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To answer Mike's question, no, I don't think that Nora feels superior to Kristine. I think that in relation to what she knows about Kristine's selflessness, Nora feels the need to show that she, herself, has done the same as her, and even more so (she 'saved' her husband). I feel like Nora, in the sense that she's confessing this to Kristine, wants someone to know about the good she's done so she can feel validated and like what she did makes her a good person.
I guess a question I have is what comes later (I read ahead .. the whole play actually) so I'll save my question till later. (:
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and I like your point Christine- is their ridiculous happiness just a cover up? (for who knows what, but just a cover up?)
I wonder what the relationship between Nora and Kristine was in the earlier years when they knew each other.
Also why is it important to have had terrible things happen to them, does that make them less childish in their eyes?
I like Sierra's take on the whole competition of terrible pasts. I agree that they may be trying to fake their really important "grown-up" lives for each other.
similar to sierra's and others questions but why is Nora so eager to be superior? Why is she so offended when Kristine suggests she hasnt been through much? What does she really mean when she questions why everyone treats her like a child? She seems fine with the way Torvald treats her...
This kind of goes along with what Sierra was asking, but why do Nora and Kristine feel the need to be so competitive with each other? ( I believe the competition was mutual..). Perhaps due to insecurities on both parts? Is it just human nature, or was there something specific?
I question I thought may be an underlying thought that may have at times is
Does Nora long to be the Dominant one in the relationship?
I think yes.
She may even be attempting to charm him in order to do it.
She says "Oh, how wonderfully lovely to hear!(trying to charm him) [Taking his arm.] Now I'll tell you just how I thought we should plan things."
She's very absorbed with what she's trying to convey here. She must have an intention to get something very important if she's using these words.
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i agree with the questions about nora and Kristine's relationship, and the whole mystery behind Nora's "big" secret. i am also wondering, however, if there is something significant about Helmer that we will discover. i do not think that he will be a blank character, so there HAS to be more to him as well. The characters are all unified in the sense that they all seem to be holding onto a secret.
...even the maid.
Mike: it DOES feel like "dinner with friends"! GOOD OBSERVATION
Sorry this is so late my internet was down for a while...
Question: I wonder how Torvald and Nora met, and how this affects their struggle with friends and struggle with each other.
What is the big thing?
Does Nora know of her spendthrifty ways?
Why does everyone think that Nora is incapable of anything serious?
Is Nora really manipulating everyone into thinking she is like a child?
To what extent is Nora materialistic?
Is material things Nora's greatest pleasure?
sorry i meant to say
Are material things Nora's greatest pleasure, not is.
Now this is sort of general, but my question is what the heck is up with Nora and Torvald? Honestly they seem like bizarre robots to me. I don't think that Kristine necessarily feels superior to Nora in such a Miss Kilman-like way; she's had her fair share of the real world and now is just having a response to Nora that I think is reasonable, given their conversation. Kristine had to marry a man she didn't love to take care of her dying mother and younger brothers and when he died had to work incredibly hard every day to support them. Now, even after saying that she'll listen to Kristine's problems, tells of her own troubles of "having" to go to Italy and needing to do needlepoint--it doesn't add up. Why is she so bizarre? Granted, we don't know the "big thing," plus Nora is clearly in a sexist relationship with all sorts of weird power given to her husband, and we still need to get to know her to know what her deal is. But I think Kristine calling her a child is perhaps not tactful, but not the wrong thing to say.
SO tonight I did the unthinkable. And I am so very, very sorry. But I read past the point we were supposed to read to. SO though I know what happens, I'm going to come up with a question as if I had not read ahead (though I can't be blamed because this play is very good).
Okay question:
What is the doctor's exact relationship to the couple? I wonder how he plays into the story as it progresses. Will his role be a big one or will he just be the two- dimensional friend?
Also for the sake of those who have not yet read as far as I have, I feel that it would be best that I not answer any questions. Sorry again.
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